Collaboration in Data – Ep. 214

Collaboration sounds easy until you’re staring at a half-built query, a sketchy measure, or a “temporary” spreadsheet that somehow became production. In Ep. 214, Mike, Tommy, and Seth talk about collaborating while you explore—how to bring in another brain at the right time, share work-in-progress safely, and turn rough exploration into decisions the whole team can trust.

News & Announcements

• Step 5 in the Data Exploration Journey: The Magic of Collaboration — A practical guide to when to bring a collaborator into an exploratory project, how to set expectations, and how to structure the ask so you get useful feedback instead of confusion.

• Submit a Topic for the Podcast — Drop a Fabric/Power BI scenario or question you want the crew to debate on a future show.

• Subscribe to the PowerBI.tips Podcast — One page with the latest episodes and where to follow the show.

Main Discussion

Topic: Collaboration in data exploration

The conversation centers on a simple idea: exploration only helps the business if other people can see what you saw and reproduce what you did. That means collaborating on questions, definitions, and artifacts—not just trading screenshots at the end.

Takeaways you can apply immediately:

• Create a lightweight trail of evidence: notes, screenshots with context, sample outputs, and links to the queries/measures that produced them.
• Share something runnable (a PBIX, a query, a notebook) whenever possible—review is faster when a teammate can click/refresh instead of guessing.
• Split work by decision: one person validates business definitions and edge cases while another prototypes the visuals/model—but sync on the same question and metric definitions.
• Keep a single source of truth for key measures early, even if it’s rough; conflicting definitions are the fastest way to burn a week.
• Use short review loops: a 15‑minute “sanity check” mid‑exploration prevents hours of polishing the wrong thing.
• Document assumptions explicitly (filters, granularity, date logic, exclusions). That’s what collaborators will (rightly) challenge.
• When you ask for collaboration, make the ask specific: what you want reviewed, what you’ve tried, what’s unknown, and what “done” looks like.

Looking Forward

Pick one habit this week that makes your work reviewable—write down assumptions, share a runnable artifact, or schedule a fast mid‑exploration checkpoint—and watch collaboration get easier.

Episode Transcript

0:31 good morning and welcome back to the explicit measures podcast with Tommy Seth and Mike hello everyone and welcome to the explosive measure podcast how’s it going good morning good morning I I’m really enjoying these more than twice a week conversations I know we had a lot of recordings I just enjoy it it’s fun with you guys Tommy you can call me anytime you don’t have to be on the podcast to talk to no careful what you wish for there’s these things called Phones changing my number teams yeah exactly I want to

1:03 my number teams yeah exactly I want to start calling you at six in the morning ride hey what’s going on no I want you to call me early in the morning and go yo Adam yeah it was for you Adam so today is a momentous day for four weeks and weeks and weeks the number of the episodes for podcast on Thursdays has been odd and today in the first time since I don’t know what what episode we got like

1:33 don’t know what what episode we got like 100 something when when did Charles come on the podcast I don’t I don’t have the searchable CW Charles Webb when he was on here on a fateful Wednesday on a Wednesday and he he ruined our numbering schema and Tommy was sorely thrown off so now we are back on schedule we now have Thursdays are even though you’re welcome Thomas that was a long time ago was it yeah it was last May I think so that was over 100

2:03 May I think so that was over 100 episodes ago it’s like last mayor June Charles Webb it feels like yesterday guys it feels like it does it does talking to you guys is it just is is performs the goggles of my heart yeah I don’t even know what that means something like I heard somewhere yeah excellent so there’s been there’s been some announcements on the blog here and as I think about what we were talking about this week we had Emily Lisa on the podcast as a special episode yesterday she came to talk to us

2:34 yesterday she came to talk to us about this new feature called editing your data model on the web so basically editing editing relationships making measures awesome stuff excuse me now there is another announcement from Lauren talking about pre-announcing better power bi report integration with OneDrive and SharePoint and while these features don’t appear at the surface to be directly related I do feel like there’s potential here for some connection between these two features so overall this feature this is

3:06 features so overall this feature this is something that I’ve been very nervous about I didn’t really there wasn’t many details when they put this on the power bi adoption roadmap or power bi roadmap I guess what it would be though wave they call those things the Power Platform our platform so I didn’t know how this licensing was going to work I didn’t know who could who could make stuff in the content in SharePoint in OneDrive so it looks like again I was more worried about the licensing piece of this but it looks like if you’re a power bi Pro user or have premium licenses attached to you you can go in and you can upload power bi files to

3:37 and you can upload power bi files to SharePoint or OneDrive and you can directly view the report without having to publish anything into powerbi. com you can view the report you can interact with the report and there’s actually some interesting in the future type bullet points that they added on there and this is really this is really interesting around where opening report Auto saving edits edit directly in the browser seems really interesting here so when I read through the article

4:07 here so when I read through the article I’m curious your thoughts on that sorry no I how can you make a what’s a pre-announcement to a new announcement yeah that’s I guess this is an FYI I read it I’m like wow like this is this is an announcement of of new features coming up like this we’re pre-announcing episode 300. how do you pre-announcing the announcement that you just gave pre-announced episode 300 yes I don’t know yeah we’re yeah so that was that

4:37 know yeah we’re yeah so that was that was humorous to me like joking aside though yeah like this is this is so how have you guys interacted with files right in the past like it essentially all your PBX store it on SharePoint and then I just sync the SharePoint folder with my it treats it like like like this experience but it’s not right like there are these weird situations that I’ve gotten where for some reason my local version didn’t

5:09 for some reason my local version didn’t sync right with SharePoint and then it creates it as this weird number name thing yeah yeah so the the fact just from the development standpoint that this that takes this away right because it’s just now a unified location it sounds like or that’s the way it’s going to be presented so it says in this so this is what I was leaning into here a little bit it says in the future we will incorporate greater parity with office and plan to allow you to auto save edits in power bi desktop directly

5:39 save edits in power bi desktop directly to the cloud so it sounds like you’re you’re right Seth like it’s it’s this idea or this concept of how you go to like PowerPoint or or word right and you can go into your team’s environment click the file that’s in the SharePoint location and say open in app the app opens and it just keeps Auto saving itself back into that SharePoint location it sounds like this seems very similar it makes sense a bit when it comes to the other things in the release wave for example one of the we had an entire episode on that

6:10 entire episode on that all power bi installs will be part of office install so if you install all that’s true so in all those applications you can edit on the web yeah correct and it’s it’s like a web SharePoint right it’s blurring that line a bit more between what happens locally on your machine with desktop applications and what happens in the web as well as well as long as I still get Version Control this makes me very happy right like because this also does this does this also unify like the other implementation of sharing like

6:42 implementation of sharing like you deploying your power bi report directly right yeah how it thinks yes yes if you if you connect to your report from the power bi service and rather than browse computer yeah that will sync like whatever updates are made I don’t think so I don’t I actually I don’t think there’s anything to do with that okay so this is more just the interaction in the office ecosystem in SharePoint where hey you you cut down these barriers that’s awesome what about what about you don’t like this timing no

7:13 what about you don’t like this timing no it’s not that I don’t like it it’s more I’m just someone different I don’t know how necessary it is like I think this is going to change a lot of people interact with power bi a lot I so I think about what Emily Lisa was talking about yesterday about being able to edit a data model and this note here it says here at the very bottom we can already edit a data model in the web which is just part of a pbax file to begin with and then right here it says edit the report directly in the browser so if we’re bringing so if we’re again

7:43 so if we’re bringing so if we’re again this is what I see my Microsoft doing a lot of is they’re trying to bring full parity between desktop and what happens inside a web browser so if we’re getting to the point where I can put a file I can have it located inside SharePoint I can edit the report side of it using the browser and now I can have Emily’s tool where I’m editing the model inside the browser like that could be nice yeah I’m moving further away I would be moving you’re going to be moving this from SharePoint to OneDrive it’s I think SharePoint OneDrive is

8:14 it’s I think SharePoint OneDrive is basically the same thing oh I do it well you’re still going to three places based on that like you just if you’re gonna model the web and are we saying it has all the capabilities like bookmarks or is just moving visuals around like right now the service still has very limited in terms of rebuilding correct yeah yes and the reason I don’t like building in the service is because when when I used to build the service I could never get it out like if I built a report in a service there was no way to download what that is which I think has been remedied to some degree I think there are still occasions where you get a

8:45 are still occasions where you get a little bit of pushback around not being able to get the report down you might lock yourself into like a data set because the data set has an incremental refresh that you just can’t download a copy of the data set now set now but if you’re on an xmla endpoint you can get a Bim file out you can get the definition that much there’s there’s it’s getting a little bit more fuzzy like what is the rule now because my hard rule previously was never build anything in the web because like I could build a file and I could never get it back back but that was my and now that they’re

9:16 but that was my and now that they’re doing a better job of letting me edit in the web and getting downloads of files or potentially syncing those files directly with SharePoint better making that experience more seamless okay maybe maybe I’m gonna bend a bit more on on letting you edit in the web now but realistically the use cases like I’ve edited on the web a few times I’ve never I’ve created but just to test it out the only time I’ve done something production I’ve edited was because something broken it was needed a quick fix the report was you left the filter on in the filter Pane and you’re like

9:47 on in the filter Pane and you’re like yeah who hasn’t honestly let’s be real here let’s be real here let’s be real here but nothing where it’s actually like peer development or taking longer than 10 minutes in the web yes yes and again those are always things

9:58 again those are always things immediately I would be doing the desktop too to sync them together it was just to get something up and running but it’s not like I don’t like this I just think think I don’t know it just seems like spend your money elsewhere it’s neat but I don’t know how much this is really going to be used I don’t think it’s going to be used for a developer I think Tommy what you’re thinking about is the the pro developer the person who’s working a lot and building reports over and over again I don’t know how much I would use this feature there if if I could get a better again if I’m

10:30 if if I could get a better again if I’m like I’m like I’m I’m in leaning into the experience here a bit more right if I can get a real-time Auto saving of desktop edits directly into SharePoint and SharePoint can have a real time or more real-time acknowledging that there are changes with that file in powerbit. com I don’t know see why I wouldn’t be able to link that file from SharePoint directto parkway. com and then if I edit it in rba. com I would expect those changes to immediately be pushed down to the file so I I feel like I want that experience to be working so that way whether I edit

11:01 to be working so that way whether I edit in desktop SharePoint or the service there’s always a current version of whatever that file is doing if I had that then I think I would be a bit more lenient on go ahead edit the web it takes it a second or two and those changes then are propagated down to the file file fine but then you still have to publish it like no you don’t not in that next scenario no okay so the two scenarios and before we go way too far into this you’re either syncing that SharePoint draw SharePoint file with power bi

11:32 draw SharePoint file with power bi which Seth and I noted not the greatest experience don’t like it now if you just edit the SharePoint file it’s not synced to power bi so you still have to publish it but I’m saying that this is changing that like I’m thinking like yeah you’re experience that you understand SharePoint syncing files today is not ideal but if they’re doing this level of stuff where you can go view a file inside SharePoint okay maybe maybe if you want to edit it you don’t go to poweray. com maybe you go to your SharePoint page and edit the file directly there okay it’s the same thing as editing in the service you just

12:03 thing as editing in the service you just don’t edit in private. com’s workspace so I’m happy I’m thinking there’s got to be some better synchronization between these different things if you can increase the synchronization level and make it a bit more seamless between these different objects yeah maybe it’s been a while a long while before we’ve even gotten an enhancement to how we save files here that’s true like yeah I I I’ve got to be rebuilding I love your optimism like it’s fantastic

12:33 your optimism like it’s fantastic what about the words that you said power. com [Laughter] no one else is going to use it I gotta use it so what about the second part of of this pre announcement to the announcement about yeah here sharing reports directly from these locations to end users now mind you caveat in here this isn’t a hey we’re giving up the licensing all of that is specifically

13:04 licensing all of that is specifically laid out like you still need Pro you need to be covered by premium which is interesting that it understands that right so now ad in licensing or an E5 but like the whole one of the main tenets of the service was this is where you deploy to share things it’s governed we understand what’s being used and how it’s being used and who has access to things things and now we can directly share off these locations to to end users like in not

13:36 locations to to end users like in not the edit mode right like if you’re an individual report Seth it goes through if you’re doing in the service I wonder if that synchronizes now now they did they did make the change to the service like six months ago or whatever like to make it more like office sharing and everything else so I’m sure there’s a way we can now catalog and understand who has access to things but it’s certainly not in the service Realm

14:10 now within the office ecosystem you have access to this SharePoint location or OneDrive right so how like to me like that just goes like there’s two parts that are that make me like one is one is the administration aspect of power bi service and sharing and the other is security right around people not shouldn’t be seeing some things with random links being shared granted that’s that that that that holds true for all data and documents

14:40 for all data and documents everything you can put it in Excel and share the same thing yeah however what are your guys’s thoughts it makes it easier but I think it’s going to be I think it’s gonna be dangerous honestly I do think this is going to be yeah I think people well I I think I think I’m gonna get a proliferation of well again this is where this is where I’m a little bit caught too right why would I want to build a whole bunch of workspaces where if instead I can just give people a bunch of files like my whole team if I if we had E5 licenses and we didn’t know

15:11 if we had E5 licenses and we didn’t know any better we could build a whole bunch of power bi files we could just throw them down in our SharePoint page and never even touch powerbit. com so that that’s interesting of itself and then where does the activity logging go is that something we’re going to catch as an admin somewhere it does that does this use are we if we’re on a premium SKU are we using capacity now or is this or is this only a Microsoft managed capacity right so does this ever now now right though is you you can’t you can’t set up an automated refresh

15:43 you can’t set up an automated refresh however however however just because my processes follow service follow automated refresh follow all these things that have been part of the ecosystem I every single new user every single one some or a business unit that does not understand the ecosystem of power bi is already doing this they’re sharing these files directly yes right so but at the same time they also have to manually refresh the file somebody’s got to

16:13 refresh the file somebody’s got to manually refresh the file so it’s you manually refresh the file so it’s like it are you really know like it are you really solving a problem by being able to share the report version of something to other users in this ecosystem maybe it makes sense from the dev point of view rather than publishing a report where you’re in development you just share the OneDrive yeah you all know that’s not how it’s going to be I I know I’m together I’m trying to be like Mike some positive positive energy yeah try to be positive guys geez guys geez but no you’re right like it’s not gonna it can’t sync with power bi audit logs

16:45 it can’t sync with power bi audit logs because it’s right in a positive light what what are the problems that this this new pre-announcement announcement solves solves I think I think this is what this is opening up is it’s opening up the ability for people to quickly glean an image or look at a report at a high level even or even now like if I walk away from a client and they have a whole bunch of power bi files that we’ve put in their SharePoint I go back to them like I know the names of the report but I don’t because I see an image of the report there’s no preview I can’t do anything there so I think I

17:15 can’t do anything there so I think I think from a development team standpoint if I’m developing reports I think it’ll definitely add some value and help to your point Seth right there’s no automation I don’t think I could see any automation from this where it would automatically load those files that’s going to be the next request someone’s going to have is going to be like hey thanks for SharePoint but I can’t refresh the data it doesn’t refresh itself I’m like yeah no no dip like it’s not going to do it like it will not refresh its information so I feel like in that respect I think people are going to expect too much out of it so there’s gonna be like a tamped expectation

17:45 gonna be like a tamped expectation around this but at the end of the day I do think like we’re already doing this with Excel we’re already doing other documents you should be able to easily share these things across the ecosystem and maybe my organization doesn’t turn this on because we don’t feel that you should be landing a whole bunch of power bi files or previewing them or editing them inside SharePoint because this is a feature you can turn off this will be administrated what’s what’s the first question if you if you share this link and to to somebody as a as a report they’re going to be like yeah but the data is stale right

18:16 like yeah but the data is stale right like you’d have to manually report like refresh it every time so power bi Park makes a funny comment in the chat where sometimes companies are like it’s cheaper to get somebody to manually refresh and send it out like is it is it no because you still need the licenses right I see only Pro or I need to be covered by premium so you’re still paying that yes can you imagine that loophole actually oh it’s cheaper I’m just gonna hire we’re gonna hire a whole bunch of people to open the files

18:46 bunch of people to open the files refresh them and save them that was the first two years of my power wheel I’ll RBI life yeah because we are our odbc connections didn’t work so yeah yeah oh yeah oh yeah this you lived you lived my job first two hours every day getting in at six in the morning it was refresh you report to publishing them oh man so we’re going back to that no I read this article and it’s like cool that’s there’s there’s nothing that’s like this is going to be detrimental but I don’t think it’s going to be anything where

19:16 think it’s going to be anything where companies are going to shift their process and they’re gonna be part of documentation this is a one-pager of like hey if you want to view things but I don’t nobody said the magic word this this morning oh it’s not even close to that nobody nobody said that Tommy so of course it’s not a huge organizational thing thing or I don’t think you’re going to see a lot even not like a complete shift but I don’t see don’t see this is just gonna be part of something did you could do wow that’s neat and then everyone moves on actually I think it’s all the problems we’re talking about when it comes to

19:46 we’re talking about when it comes to audit logs sharing and that’s out of sync and I think it’s going to have a wider impact on that I do I do I do also see I want to see how well there’s

19:56 see I want to see how well there’s there’s going to be a deeper integration based on the screenshots they have a deeper integration between desktop and the SharePoint OneDrive locations anyways so I’ll be interested to see how they’re going to play this out and if there’s a way to if they can improve my experience between powerba. com these files SharePoint and OneDrive I think in my mind this makes a lot of sense and also if if you’re talking about refreshing data sets like we could we could be landing a whole bunch of thin reports here too right so these don’t have to be necessarily

20:27 don’t have to be necessarily they do I thought clicking double click as as a couple people in my order double click let me double click into what you just said okay you if you go there’s a there’s a note there documentation and I I think for right now now I think for right now it’s all import yeah yeah I actually wouldn’t work with this RLS isn’t supported

20:58 just like our conversation with Emily yesterday right where I go right away like is there a link to techno technical documentation yes scroll all the way to the bottom consideration limitations it is on their roadmap they said they did say in the future we would like to let you look at view reports connected to data sets in power bi service so I say we would like you to we’ll just says pipe dream no it says in the future we will incorporate greater parity view reports connected to data sets and power bi service so it’s not there right now day one but I would imagine that

21:29 day one but I would imagine that would be something you’d get to eventually be great if the documentation is like it would be great if we could do this yeah it would be great make sure you like And subscribe and fill it out yeah yeah every documentation I want from Microsoft have it wouldn’t be need section yes exactly anyways interesting topic I think this is very relevant the only thing I would really make a note here is you can enable the public preview or you can turn it off there are some settings that need to be enabled or disabled to be able to do this so I believe those who

22:00 able to do this so I believe those who are administrating they’re in power bi environments or SharePoint you may need to coordinate with your it Department to make sure you’re either turning this on or off depending on what you want I thought there was something concerning here that they mentioned at the top that there’s a feature that is on by default on or off on or off there’s there’s one on and one on driving SharePoint from Power bi desktop previews on by default yeah and requires an opt out the to disable the preview power bi files directly in OneDrive and SharePoint is

22:32 directly in OneDrive and SharePoint is an opt-in correct the saving part is on by default that’s fine but I can I can I like the way they did that the preview is off by default the saving is on by default yeah yeah which would make sense so anyway just be be aware of those things that way you can observe that in the way you that it’s coming and people ask about it you’ll know about it anyways good topics I think that’s going to be interesting feature looking forward to seeing it come through I like where they’re going with things

23:03 I like where they’re going with things all right moving on to our main article today today after we’re halfway through this thing we got debated we were debating pretty hard on that one it wasn’t a big deal but apparently it was a big deal apparently it was a big deal apparently I’m going to make a big deal pre-announcements so we’re gonna jump into an article by Erica off of Nightingale devs. com so this is our article for today it’s reviewing the link I’ll put it also in the chat window well here Erica gun and so this is a very interesting

23:34 and so this is a very interesting article around again this is a very similar topic potentially data exploration Journey the magic of collaboration so this is a bit more about focusing on data and the exploration of information and data and working collaborative to figure out does that look like how do you explore data so really interesting article she has a really neat diagram that’s that’s kind really neat diagram that’s that’s a of a a little a little chart that I think is very interesting to to look at I I believe I did some

24:04 to look at I I believe I did some ideation training a long time ago when I was back in my corporate job and I feel like this chart showed up similar a similar chart showed up to this that I was working through where you you like discover more things and as you discover more things you you absorb more ideas like so that all ideas are good ideas we want to have a really wide net cast a lot of ideas down and then we narrow our scope we throw out ideas that aren’t good and then we kind ideas that aren’t good and then we broaden our scope again and say okay of broaden our scope again and say okay how do we solve the problem and then we narrow our scope again so this feels a

24:35 narrow our scope again so this feels a bit like that where you’re you’re trying to articulate the idea of we have information we have data how do we get through this creative process of being able to design data exploration Journeys or stories on top of your information and I got stuck there but probably probably in a different way right from those but similar similar but different the the the point I wanted to make is is that whether it’s

25:07 to make is is that whether it’s the exploration of data or I suppose this makes sense on anything data related but also at the very front end in delivery as well there’s always this this curve right or in in their view how do I do this right yeah yeah well it is expanding in focus and understanding like all of these different Realms and and hitting that overload Point there’s the Tipping Point that comes

25:37 there’s the Tipping Point that comes down into focused analysis where you’re going to spend a lot of time solving that problem and whether that’s on the front end or when you’re building it the same process continues the point I want to make is it’s really critical though that that’s why it’s really critical to have a very clear idea of what you’re trying to solve in all of those stages because what happens a lot from experience right in in when I first began in data you

26:08 in in when I first began in data you would go you’d get into these projects or something where you’d have a very large expanded scope and then you’d be like ah okay I’m gonna go and I’m gonna hone in on this thing and you spend a lot more time honing in to try to solve something and and you miss the mark and then you got to start over right because actually you didn’t really have a clear idea of of what it was you were trying to solve with your deeper analysis and and or that equates to the same thing on the front end even when

26:39 same thing on the front end even when you go through this find all your data sets set it all up did you deliver what the end user needed right and and a lot of wasted effort can be introduced into these project Cycles because you don’t have that clear idea so as I was like looking at this chart of like expanding and then honing down down I I thought about that and just wanted to make the point that that’s why it’s really a really good idea to have a clear idea of if I’m going to spend a bunch of time what does

27:10 going to spend a bunch of time what does that output look like and that also stops you from going down into rabbit holes when you’re doing that focused analysis because that can happen too well and part of this is personality too and I I don’t think we give enough credit to personality traits and how important that is and also our space and where what can be detrimental and what can be really productive let me ask you guys do are you guys better working with teams or are you better working alone depends on what we’re doing I think I

27:41 depends on what we’re doing I think I don’t know it’s still like working with me I’m kidding well if I put this in the lens of the article here one of one of the first why collaborate elements here at the top here is Define diversity of thought right so one of these opportunities to be able to get together with people who think differently than you you the the outflow of a production of multiple people that have very different backgrounds usually produces something

28:11 backgrounds usually produces something that is better than the some of the one person it’s the term Synergy Right comes to mind right we build a Synergy around these people that have a wide variety of skills and I think that’s something that I’ve tried to put in to my company to some degree where we have like people who are very app Dev focused when people are their design focused we have people they’re model focused right and if you have these different skill sets when you bring them all together you now have a very diverse thought on like okay how can you get to a better product as a combination of these things because then you’re You’re

28:42 because then you’re You’re Building better scrims in the background so it makes it feel more app-esque right you’re doing you’re simplifying your data model to make it easier to consume and build measures like there’s a lot of assets I think to this I don’t think you can do this on every project let me be clear yeah sometimes projects aren’t big enough for more than one person but I think the idea here is there are certain projects or there are certain things that you’re going to do either for fun or finding people that are similar in nature to you again I’m talking a little bit less around like the project in the company because you’re like in those

29:12 because you’re like in those cases you’re stuck right okay Mike here’s your project this is your report you need to build figure it out like that’s a bit I don’t think that’s exactly what this article is talking about I feel like this article is talking about a bit more around you is talking about a bit more around how do you find like-minded people know how do you find like-minded people who like data and and how do you work well with them and why would you want to work with them because there’s things you can potentially learn from them that’s kind potentially learn from them that’s how I’m reading it a little bit Yeah of how I’m reading it a little bit Yeah and and I agree with that right but I I think to some degree there’s there’s two points that we can talk

29:42 two points that we can talk about one is obviously that like the club collaboration team building diversity Etc versus the collaboration within a specific power bi project as well right because the there are a lot of similarities

29:57 of similarities between those two but to answer your question on my part I think there’s a time and place for both I I enjoy working in both like together and apart right because a lot of what we do is can be just data analysis it’s analyzing understanding an area of business you can’t sometimes that elicits multiple people but typically it’s you’re on your own you’re trying to solve a problem and that that’s not great collaborate collaboration areas but building reports right like putting together Pages making sure

30:29 putting together Pages making sure that we understand like our producing what the end user is expecting like those are great opportunities for teams to collaborate together and talk through like bring different perspectives bring different experiences Etc Etc which will be a lot easier on SharePoint too by the way I I do like I do like Mike’s Point if you think about one of one of team building right or just finding people to collaborate with is diversity of thinking and skills is a

31:01 is diversity of thinking and skills is a is a really valuable thing if you get everybody like if if to Mike’s Point if he hired the same skill set across everything then when all those people get together they’re just you just get yep yep yep sounds good right everything is a very similar album we all agree we all agree I agree we all agree it is it is the way it is the way this is the way yes versus diversity of skill sets for you diversity of skill sets for different areas of the report great

31:31 know different areas of the report great but sometimes that’s where bringing in a full-time analyst or bringing in somebody who’s expertise over the years has been UI ux right instead of power bi refresh like interjects some really refreshing ideas around that challenge status quo and I I think dynamically you think about the conversations that we have in in this forum we’re collaborative we’re collaborating together we we don’t all think the same way there’s there’s some

32:02 think the same way there’s there’s some similarity in thought but our personalities are are different right right and I think that’s what makes Dynamic Dynamic conversation which is also what illicit new ways of thinking about problems and and solving them and I’ll take a quick high level I think Mike something you said stuck out to me we’re talking about the different people you’re working with honestly from a high level regardless of the real the audience that you have or the the dialogue that you’re going to have whoever that person is this really goes

32:33 whoever that person is this really goes back to the importance of the communication skills and the setting expectations on what are you supposed to get out of the project or what are you trying to get out of this whether it’s me working with you or me working with a stakeholder or me working on building a report who’s doing what what are we trying to get out of this regardless if if we’re similar or not it’s aligning expectations and having that over communication that’s something that I found regardless of the project or the person or the skill set is setting that up from the

33:04 is setting that up from the Forefront of what are we trying to do together or who’s going to do what and what are we trying to get out of this yes yes I listened to a it was a talk from Rob calling he was talking about very similar in this scenario right if you had someone sit down and write an app or a piece of code right the the code that is the end of the project is whatever three pages long or however many lines of code that is right you many lines of code that is right 300 400 lines of code right that’s

33:35 know 300 400 lines of code right that’s the output of the project the input to that project is a lot of communication and requirements and all this extra work that is trying to make sure everyone’s on the same page and there is there’s always going to be this high volume of communication Clarity you can’t when I’m building reports just for me an audience of myself it’s very easy to communicate because I’m I’m just internally focusing on what I need to build what’s helpful for me but as soon as you involve other people there is this need for a higher levels of communication and so I it adds value but

34:07 communication and so I it adds value but it also potentially slows the project down a lot as well well and for myself one of my I think biggest hurdles starting in the power bi world or just from a professional was I like to take things and run I would assume too many things and I’ve really tried to make that one of the stronger skill sets on anything we do what what are the objectives and goals we’re trying to get out of this yeah and we’re going to follow up on that and here’s what we talked about because I know myself I’ll just run with things and go oh well I thought you meant this and you either get the dissatisfaction with

34:38 get the dissatisfaction with the people you’re working with or you’re to Seth’s Point you’re not completing the goal the goal take it on take it on a Ted when you’re actually doing successfully and you have those Communication in place the collaboration could be one of the most fruitful things you do in a professional career and those are some of the most enjoyable and things moments and some of the things that I can still remember what I’ve learned from those projects where I was collaborated with others yeah both audiences so let’s let’s hang

35:11 yeah both audiences so let’s let’s hang into where the article like Dives and if we want to divert into power bi and specific team projects Etc we can but because I I think she brings up some really interesting points that we’ve talked about a little bit in terms of getting involved and engaged in community right A lot of the things like there are several reference points where her recommendation around wanting to collaborate with others whether that be a project that you’re passionate about or find

35:42 passionate about or find a way to plug in with people is is to join a community find find like-minded individuals that revolve around the same realm and that’s where user groups right where yes podcast in the chat right like the data communities and people that are already engaging in these conversations that’s where you meet them right correct and and the the the important part about wanting to collaborate with people that I love about the point she makes in here is you

36:15 about the point she makes in here is you need it like you you obviously want to be intentional if you are you have a project that you want to engage others but it’s about building relationships first I like that point a lot too yes and that is that is something especially I find I find recently for some reason and recently by like the last couple years is is there are a lot of people that want like demand time without a relationship right that’s very true what’s happening is the default for people who are

36:47 is the default for people who are Community Driven or who are out there or wherever is to just ignore the request because there’s no relationship there right and that’s where it’s you if you’re if you’re serious about something you you need to engage with people first and a great way to you do that is in spaces that these people who know data who live it who like enjoy interacting with one another live and start to live there too right and that requires you to not just go to a meeting

37:19 requires you to not just go to a meeting or show up but to her Point put yourself out there yes join in in the conversation right and understand that everybody is at different levels throughout everybody’s experience right so just because you may be coming in on a low end or because in in the article in here she knew nothing about R so she engaged somebody who knew had that strength but she had her own strengths right and that’s where looking at this in the perspective of people bringing

37:50 in the perspective of people bringing different qualities to a project are are a value add but just engaging you got to put yourself out there first I totally agree with that one I I think of a community so a couple things that I would so we’re talking about Community people getting together sorry I just damn Dan’s comment be careful putting yourself out there that’s how he met Mike and Seth I’m sorry I’m sorry [Laughter] oh boy there are consequences there are

38:20 oh boy there are consequences there are consequences to doing these actions yes warning your violent your mileage may vary on this this recommendation yeah you you don’t know who you’re gonna meet right right so we I would also Echo this from a like areas for people who are newer to the power bi Community where could you get involved where would you find some similarities amongst others in this space there’s a lot of online communities right so there’s meetups there’s now if you go to meet up and you look power look up power bi there’s

38:50 you look power look up power bi there’s a lot of user groups all over the world that are doing that you can go to community. powerbay. com there’s also a bunch of community groups that have groups that are listed inside powerbi. com and helping people get together and collaborate there is I know Guyana cube is like a stream every Saturday there’s a live stream that you can participate there I know there’s other groups that are participating on a early morning Saturday call just to get together and talk about power bi one community that I’m really enjoying right now is is the duneb community there’s a lot of people building and

39:20 there’s a lot of people building and visualizing data that’s in there as well that’s another group of people that are very focused on visual things so I really like that’s that spin there is again I’ll I’ll liken this to where my experience has been I’m surprised I’m a drummer I’ve been I’ve played drums for pretty much my whole life but being a musician when you play with musicians you always want to find other people that are better than you to play with because it always brings your level up to to be

39:52 always brings your level up to to be able to like oh man that was really hard

39:53 able to like oh man that was really hard these guys are really good so in the same way I look for like people in the visualization space that are part of my band members right people that are doing things that I want to be doing and so I ask questions to them I talk to them I build those relationships so that way when I have a question to Ruby Romano about all this code stuff that he’s writing and I can play hey rui I need some help your code doesn’t make sense to me or and and I find a lot of things where if you’re if you’re an individual who’s looking to figure out how do I how do I break into

40:23 figure out how do I how do I break into that space how do I start getting myself out there at part of the community there’s a lot of again one thing I’ll recommend is rui had a whole bunch of examples and things on GitHub and I would read through his code and try and find things that are in there and I was working on his code and I would submit some pull requests back hey look I added some comments to your your code here right I I it didn’t make sense to me it wasn’t documented to so I could understand it so I added some enhancements to it what do you think and we and then we would form a relationship so you basically try to

40:54 relationship so you basically try to find areas where you can assist and help a project along and when you jump in and help that project along you’re you’re they’re able to say oh look this guy’s will or gal is willing to participate is willing to jump in here and help move this forward that’s how you start building some of those relationships I think and I want to take that a step forward where don’t be afraid to getting or working on mentorship part of the amazing part of this community and I think with the Microsoft MVPs is if you really like an article by someone or really like some that a

41:26 someone or really like some that a contribution that someone did reach out to them especially through Microsoft MVPs odds are they’re going to be happy to help and if you’re coming from I think of a sincere place too I’ve done that I actually reached out to Kurt Bueller about like I don’t know how you always create all these articles I want to actually learn your process for your consistent amazing articles and because that’s something that I wanted to do and learning from the best Kurt’s been been consistently putting out articles but really good yeah but even when it comes

41:57 really good yeah but even when it comes to the community when it comes to if you’re learning something specific in the power bi space or you’re just trying to learn a new skill set the reason why I think we have the MVPs and Microsoft’s invested in the community is because they understand that own like in a sense organic ecosystem so to speak so don’t be afraid to look for mentorships especially if they’re at your own job if you can identify one I I will say this about Microsoft MVPs or just MVPs in general that I’ve experienced a lot of the MVPs are very busy is what I would

42:29 the MVPs are very busy is what I would say so don’t reach out to Mike you can it just you may not get a response don’t be offended if you don’t but I feel like MVPs are very engaged with Community try and meet them where they’re at so if they’re speaking at an event up here right if they’re if they’re doing some other things like engage initially that way to start forming some of those relationships but I would also Echo too MEPS are a great opportunity there’s actually a lot of other really smart very sharp people in the community that are not MVPs and

43:00 in the community that are not MVPs and potentially should be they just don’t have what I would call like part of being an MVP is having a casting a wide audience around whatever you’re we are working on right so I think there’s a lot of people that are just just crushing it doing really awesome things in the community it just may be a little bit harder to find them because Microsoft’s not pushing as much I don’t I don’t think I know that right like we’re a very small subset of of the total individuals that like love power constantly talking about stuff or doing things and putting stuff out there but

43:31 things and putting stuff out there but also at the same time like a lot of MVPs are are the group organizers right it’s it’s the community aspect where like getting you will find technical Professionals in any one of these communities right and they are likely going to have much more time around specific needs like Mentor mentor to me is a a bigger deal right on on the realm of like we are already like well established and we have relationships

44:01 relationships that’s a good point there’s a specific thing that you want to get better at that that person is an expert in or you just really admire and you want you want them to help guide you and and has a specific outcome right so in this realm with collaboration though like it’s not to me it’s not that heavy it’s like a mentorship is consistent it’s it’s typically meeting quite a bit like talking about objectives helping you think through

44:32 objectives helping you think through processes and then that person going and doing things and trying to elevate themselves in their career etc etc collaboration is more around like Hey how do we do something together I’ve I’m passionate about developing this report around the Yankees hey Tommy I know you love them right like what you want to get together and let’s have dinner yeah exactly yeah let’s do Let’s do let’s talk about this stuff right hey you’re passionate about this thing or I love Mike like Mike your way you introduced yourself to rui it’s like hey this guy’s already got a

45:03 it’s like hey this guy’s already got a bunch of stuff out there I’m gonna I’m gonna go put myself out there first and help him with his projects that he’s doing and engage in a relationship there first yeah and by doing so hey there’s this other ancillary thing that I’m working on too are you interested in engaging in that right yeah and that’s that’s where like the parts in here where where being specific about what type of collaboration you’re looking for right be set up your expectations understand like convey the limits as far as like

45:34 like convey the limits as far as like what it what is it you expect from from this other individual right and making sure that it is mutually beneficial or that something that they would be interested in before you go do that and what does that require you’re the first person you meet that knows power bi is not probably not going to be the person that you want to collaborate with you need to you need to get into these communities yeah where you you see a wide spectrum of how people are thinking about things what are their backgrounds how are they working on power bi but like and that a

46:05 working on power bi but like and that a lot of that happens in af like a user group setting where like the way we run things is like afterwards there’s a team’s meeting right who’s showing up on video who’s asking questions hey tell me about what’s going on what are you guys working on et cetera et cetera like float those those questions out there and a lot of times people are like oh yeah I work in administration all the time and this is what we do and how we do it and then that that way you start to develop those relationships but all the while right you can be strategic about like how

46:37 you can be strategic about like how you’re engaging with communities because maybe maybe you want to collaborate with somebody right but ultimately it the funny thing about it is it’s going to expand or or add add value to you even before you get to the collaboration because you’re already you’re getting out there in the community you’re talking to other people and and there’s a ton of value in that which all of us agree with I slightly want to shift in in terms of

47:07 I slightly want to shift in in terms of from Community to within your organization where I think if you can’t identify someone in your organization to collaborate with regardless if they’re even in the power bi space whether it’s a project You’re Building like you are building a project but it’s someone from another department to collaborate on can be so fruitful but there’s more than just the benefit of I think just the article of I’m learning I’m getting a new skill set you’re also identifying people at the organization and what they do in terms of who can I

47:37 and what they do in terms of who can I reach out to for this who has some sway here and I think there’s a big part of that it’s not necessarily always guaranteed you’re going to find people willing to or that have in a sense the in a sense the Necessities but if you can find people in your organization like hey I’m working on we’re working on this report I know you don’t do reports but I want to get your feedback on this and one part of the building the relationships that your organization but also understand that like almost let me help you like I’ll scratch your back you

48:08 help you like I’ll scratch your back you scratch mine there’s a lot of benefits there that honestly I I really just want to emphasize that it’s not just Community where collaboration can happen and it doesn’t have to be just you’re a power bi guy I’m a power bi person great it could be someone that knows or has a skill set or has knowledge in somewhere in the organization you don’t and I think if I if I think about the broader Community right the community of practice around power bi this fits very well with that and honestly if I’m I’m

48:40 well with that and honestly if I’m I’m not trying to put my my power bi Administration hat on here too much but this is an activity that you want to encourage in your organization and I think this should be an activity that is somewhat LED from the the center of excellence the center of excellence should be providing opportunities call it challenges lunch and learns power bi Power hours like there needs to be some space inside your company to find these like-minded people because people just don’t won’t naturally sit down to each other at a lunchroom or

49:10 down to each other at a lunchroom or whatever if your company is big enough I don’t know if you have a lunchroom or not but if you sit down and you just won’t find these people and be like oh yeah hey Tommy I I didn’t know I didn’t know you were in finance oh you’re doing Power by reports stuff okay interesting what are you working on and that’s and that’s a really great opportunity where you can say well Thomas I’m struggling with these Dax things I’m trying to build this profit and loss statement how would I do that and oh I got an idea and oh I heard something here and then you add value to their project or effort and that’s where you can really start forming relationships across right business teams but

49:40 across right business teams but the point here I want to make is the center of excellence or the leadership team of what’s going on in power bi they should be driving these opportunities to the organization and making sure people

49:51 the organization and making sure people have the ability to find other like-minded people because they’re there yeah yeah James you’re perfectly right like it’s just the same concept and I think part of this like the some of the most fruitful projects I worked on were came from something completely organic with someone a Vice President of Sales who built a relationship with and they understood what I did I they kind they understood what I did I they became the liaison for sales and it of became the liaison for sales and it happened from organic conversations and it’s part relationship but part collaborating like rather than going to

50:21 collaborating like rather than going to this you’re the bi person I need a task just talking having other conversations is part of the collaboration so and I agree and I think that needs to be fostered more work and your service your support you build a report yeah I think I think for I I like the points right yes absolutely within an organization a Coe or business intelligence team or data Dojo whatever you want to call it like could could definitely create these opportunities for collaboration and that collaboration or that project could be

50:51 collaboration or that project could be very company specific right so that there’s a there’s already that Mutual together like Hey we’re gonna go to do this thing together because it’s going to benefit the same company we will work for ETC for ETC one of the callouts I do want to make before before we have to wrap up is some of the pitfalls that she calls out to avoid and I and I overheim these are some really good points yes the first the first off while reading these is what I’ve seen is that because just because you’re

51:23 that because just because you’re passionate about something it may not be that anybody else is right and and that’s true that Union of a collaboration is such that like how she outlines is both of these people were very interested in doing this project together together right just because you’re interested doesn’t mean that the person who may have those technical skills is so her three points are don’t make others responsible for your project which you should never have an idea and then just

51:53 should never have an idea and then just like hey I found a person who’s gonna help me or like offer into this thing and then it’s just this one-sided like wait where where are you thing collaboration is not a way to get free help or work from a professional which is a solid one because I’ve seen that before in there it’s like well if if you’re asking them to do something that they get paid to do you should typically want to get paid paid that thing yes exactly true right right this

52:24 thing yes exactly true right right this is where I’m in love right I I made that point earlier about it’s got to be a mutually beneficial like people have to want to engage in something together to go attack a collaboration and then her final point is this is not a fun it this is not a fun only Zone and we know that every like everything you do has a cost and typically that cost is time yes and the more the more the more things you do the less time

52:54 the more things you do the less time you have right so this is where we’ve Tommy I think you already made the comment right like people are busy like and the more you more visible people are or the higher you go in an organization or you run your own company like we we’re probably some of the least like have about the least amount of time to give as possible which is why it’s so great to like get into a community of people with that’s at work or whatever in these Frameworks that like you guys are probably have more time together

53:25 are probably have more time together than the people that are leading the group or bringing all the people together or doing doing the speaking Etc this is why we only talk on a podcast together I I can’t emphasize enough that it does have to be mutually beneficial as much as people want to help it’s not all altruistic where if you just come to someone go I want you to do this or hey help me do this and there’s not in a

53:55 help me do this and there’s not in a sense the perceived benefit for the other person it’s not really collaboration and that person’s probably not going to be as willing to help so that can’t be emphasized enough collaboration is that relationship building for both people how many how many times have you been hit up on LinkedIn or like hey Tommy I I have a data model yeah yeah okay I have this data model Dax question can you help me out I’m like yeah well I’ll do your research have you looked in the community have you I don’t even answer. com my rate is here’s my rate yeah well I I

54:28 my rate is here’s my rate yeah well I I literally didn’t even get hate Thomas like I have a Dax problem I’m trying to do this not even a hey how are you doing yeah don’t do that yeah don’t don’t do the don’t do the sales tactic that it apparently is really popular lately which is I have no idea who you are yes like hi hi Seth when when this week can I schedule this 10 to 15 minute meeting oh the stinking time you can’t and you ignore it won’t because oh thanks Chad I don’t want your well I will I’ll give LinkedIn

54:58 want your well I will I’ll give LinkedIn some credit LinkedIn is doing a much better job of being able to tell like I have that little Auto prompting that says no thank you and then yeah someone will respond to me and they’ll ask me a question I’m like hello I’m so glad you in I’m so glad we got an introduction and then it’ll be like okay I’ll I don’t respond and then like a week later like oh hello I’d like to schedule a meeting with you can we schedule a meeting and then the automatic prompt actually shows up it says no thank you and then I click it and then I move on so if I don’t respond unless the audio

55:35 don’t come out of the blue and and try to like you need to have the relationship there first well but I do want to I do want to make money okay here though sure when you when you put in this work finding the right people to collaborate and this show is an example of that it can is one of the most rewarding things it can be extremely fun for as much for as much work as is involved to put together a project or

56:05 involved to put together a project or something that you’re doing together with people finding the right folks putting together and doing something collaboratively it can be one of the most rewarding things you do so it is definitely worth it and sometimes it just takes a little bit of time to find the right folks and get it off the ground running but if you have an idea and you want to run with it definitely definitely I would suggest it’s definitely worth it and I I think I can say definitely definitely a lot more depth I think you

56:35 definitely a lot more depth I think you should say it one more time yeah I definitely think that’s meaning yourself you definitely definitively agree with my I definitely agree finally what’s your definition of those definite statements I think you’re correct I think the best the best Dr seussing of things happened yesterday with Emily on on the podcast oh yeah so if you wanna if you want a data someone just about that one three quarters the way through yeah where was where was Kratos on that one yeah we need we need to snip at that one can you model on a plane can you model on a train I think

57:05 plane can you model on a train I think that’s where we went with that one the model on a far I can model and a cleaner model can you model in a car yeah I can model from afar exactly I think I think I think this is going to be a thing maybe that was it I think it’s something around that anyways what does chat DPT said say today so today our question for chat GPT is list three method list three methods to find people to collaborate on a data project so one would be online platforms and communities there are numerous online platforms that you can go look at

57:36 online platforms that you can go look at we we got there as well professional networking events and conferences I don’t think we talked about conferences but I think I found a lot of really interesting people at conferences I agree with that and I would also say that’s maybe where you’ll find those experts that are not MVPs potentially because people are going to see other people they’re Learners and they want to go learn something about that conference we built Alum toolkit Before It’s actually an app he packages it up as one who just got on GitHub at a conference yeah someone I met there was

58:07 conference yeah someone I met there was phenomenal see and and then the third recommendation was look for people on social media and online forums utilizing social media platforms like LinkedIn Twitter and Reddit and Reddit I will say is a very fun Community the Reddit Community around power bi is fun they keep throwing out memes every so often I dig those memes so those are those are enjoyable to say the least yeah exactly yeah see episode 50 where we talk about memes you can’t see Tommy’s favorite topic right there we’ll probably have to do a revisit on that one because there’s so many good new memes that are out there that we’ll talk

58:38 memes that are out there that we’ll talk about when we get the 500. announcing episode 500 pre-announcing episode 500. we’re gonna that’s gonna have a High attendance we’ve already sold it get your memes now episode 500. and write it down Tommy we’re gonna we’re gonna have to do it if we ever make it there excellent so with that you’ve you’ve wasted a perfectly good hour with us it has been a lot of fun great conversation hope everyone can find someone in a community or get plugged in somewhere

59:09 community or get plugged in somewhere you already are plugged in with our community so thank you very much for listening our only ask is to go find more people share this podcast with other people let them know that you found some value from it we’d love to have more people participating chatting and engaging with these topics it’s it’s not hardcore power bi stuff it’s that the water cooler conversation around power bi things Tommy where else can you find the podcast you can find the podcast anywhere it’s available apple and Spotify make sure to subscribe you can listen to all of our previous episodes and you can also leave a rating helps us out a ton finally join the

59:40 helps us out a ton finally join the conversation live every Tuesday and Thursday 7 30 a. m Central on all power bi. tips social media channels excellent thank you all very much and we’ll see you next week

Thank You

Want to catch us live? Join every Tuesday and Thursday at 7:30 AM Central on YouTube and LinkedIn.

Got a question? Head to powerbi.tips/empodcast and submit your topic ideas.

Listen on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.